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Isn't this ridiculous? All because of her previous conviction 4 years ago. I am not a big fan of her but I think this is over the top. She's not a murderer, or violent or mentally unstable for that matter.

People on here who have seen my posts about England's history know I'm not a huge fan. But it seems quite hypocritical. A country that is historically notorious for exploiting other territories around the world and refuse entry to a successful woman who can generate business for England's economy.

What do you guys think? I know what she did is considered illegal but had none of this ever happened I think any of us would have probably done the same thing if we were in her shoes. If you knew your shares were going to plummet in value would you honestly not try and sell them so as to not lose out? I can't say that I know of anyone who honestly wouldn't have done the same thing.

It is ridiculous, but we've got a bit of a tit for tat thing going with America, who turn down British people for visas all the time, so I don't think she should take it too personally. Though she is a convicted criminal and a crime is a crime, whether it is white collar or not.

I have no idea why you should bring up Britain's history as far as exploiting other territories goes in your post, very few countries have whiter than white pasts.

Loz

After reading your post I had a strong feeling that you were from England. And after checking out your profile I was right.

I see a lot of English people coming to America. In fact, a lot of commercials are using people that speak with a British accent. I have nothing against the British simply for being British since part of my ancestral roots are from there. But as an American I don't appreciate how a lot of British are taking jobs away from plenty of more than qualified Americans. And from what I can see America doesn't really do much in terms of rectifying or reprimanding the British for coming into the states yet I can't easily go to England and work. It's a double standard. But god forbid if a Mexican tries to cross the border they are herded up like wild animals that tried to escape and dumped on their native land.

I know of a guy that is from London that came to the U.S. and created a false American social security number in order to get a job and work in the U.S. When all was discovered he didn't even get so much as a slap on the wrist for committing what the U.S. considers a federal crime. I think that's a hell of a lot more audacious than Martha Stewart's crime.

And you're right, the whole world is raping and exploiting everyone else but England has gotten her claws into just about everything and then has the audacity to forbid entry to a successful person into their own country that will only profit and benefit people on all sides. She was to go there to speak at the Royal Academy and to rub elbows with people in the fashion and interior design industries.

From The Future of Freedom, by Fareed Zakaria, page 57

An even more striking proof that a constitutional liberal past can produce a liberal democratic present was identified by the late political scientist Myron Weiner in 1983. He pointed out that, as of then, "every single country in the Third World that emerged from colonial rule since the Second World War with a population of at least one million (and almost all the smaller colonies as well) with a continuous democratic experience is a former British colony. British rule meant not democracy--colonialism is almost by definition undemocratic--but limited constitutional liberalism and capitalism. There are now other Third World democracies but Weiner's general point still holds. To say this is not to defend colonialism. Having grown up in a post colonial country I do not need to be reminded of the institutionalized racism and the abuse of power that was part of the imperial legacy. But it is an undeniable fact that the British Empire left behind a legacy of law and capitalism that has helped strengthen the forces of liberal democracy in many of its former colonies--though not all. France, by contrast, encouraged little constitutionalism or free markets in its occupied lands, but it did enfranchise some of its colonial populations in northern Africa. Early democratization in all those cases led to tyranny.

When did America ban slavery?

America discriminates against people with HIV from travelling to their country.

Martha Stewart is a dangerous villain. Have you seen what she does with bed sheets.

True about the slavery issue. I'm not saying that we're perfect. I just examples from history to point out that America isn't the only country that has problems.

It's so socially acceptable for the whole world to talk nastily of Americans it's like a bad cliche.

And for the record when it came to slavery the more dominant tribes in Africa were selling out their own race to Caucasian buyers. It's not only Americans at fault.

muchmorethanmuscle said
It's so socially acceptable for the whole world to talk nastily of Americans it's like a bad cliche.

This is so true, muchmorethanmuscle! It pisses me off, too.

I recommend this book to those who like to diss America. We provide the services of a world government without the right to collect taxes.

Hey, Caslon. I like that you read so much. That looks like an interesting book. I'll have to go to amazon.com to check it out.

To the rest of the world outside of America. Just because there are laws in the U.S. doesn't mean that every American supports it. Just because you see problems that arise from American intervention throughout the world doesn't mean that all Americans back it up or support it. So keep in mind when you want to castrate Americans with some below the belt remark, keep in mind that you are lumping over 300 million people as thinking and behaving the same way. It's not the case.

I'm not happy that people outside the U.S. with HIV can't enter the states. I've heard of this before but I'm not sure how it works. Who divulges what to whom and to what agency? I don't know how that works entirely. In the U.S. Americans have rights concerning privacy in regards to their medical history. If I were to go and talk about someone's medical conditions I could be sued for divulging privileged information.

I know of a guy that did this to another man concerning his hiv status. That man took him to court and won.

Sometimes I wonder how easily real issues in this country get ignored, so that the real crooks can get away with their crimes, but than I see stories like this and wonder if there's any Justice in the world, if it's just another IT word for the masses.

It's just revenge on us not letting Amy Winehouse in for the Grammy's.

I just read that Boy George was denied entry into the US for a tour. This nonsense has to stop!

Well, i dont have anything against USA, but 2 years ago a friend of mine was unable to get his visa to travel to USA for having Arabic surname. this is ridiculous because she would only travel for vacation to visit a friend of yours. this will be a test of their own medicine?

It wasn't personally against Martha. (Although the news sure did make it sound that way). I don't know the exact terms, but the UK has a law that bars people with a criminal record. She has a criminal record. Therefore she was denied.

If they had allowed her access, THAT would be hypocrisy: making an exception to an existing law for a wealthy person.

This thread has some of the most ignorant and obnoxious posts that I have read on here.

Firstly, it's not England, it's the United Kingdom that makes these decisions. They are bilateral. British people who have been convicted of a crime in the UK (or US) are similarly restricted when getting Visas and entries for the US. There is a principal of International Relations known as reciprocity that tends to prevail, less charitably known as tit for tat. America, who enjoys the better side of the power relationship, shows no sign of toning down her borders; why are we supposed to?

And do you have the TEMERITY to blame me and my countrymen for the the crimes of colonialism? I was not alive then and had no part in it, and barely any person alive today did either. For all the damage America is doing to the world, most of us are able to see also the wonderful things about America and Americans. Your charge is hypocritical, misdirected and misconceived.

Save your vitriol for those who ignorantly hate America.

Who cares about Martha Stewart?
Travel plans of a controlling billionaire are inconvenienced.
Wahhh!

Some hard facts. According the office of National Statistics (UK) (data here) about 56,000 British people emigrated to the US and 45,000 Americans immigrated to the UK over 2005/2006. The net immigration/emigration is utterly insignificant with respect to the total immigration of either country which utterly repudiates the following rubbish:

"I don't appreciate how a lot of British are taking jobs away from plenty of more than qualified Americans"

Jeez. Nimbyism in its worst form.

I know it's a law that applies to everyone. I just didn't know that it was in affect until it was brought to my attention with the news story surrounding Ms. Stewart.

I just think it's over the top. I think it should be the type of crime. If she were accused of murder or causing bodily harm to others than she should be on a tight leash.

And yes it was the UK, sorry for typing out England instead. I did start with using UK but changed it.

redheadguy saidMartha Stewart is a dangerous villain. Have you seen what she does with bed sheets.

LOL, is this what they call crimes of fashion?

crispro said
Who cares about Martha Stewart?

Right on.
less QQ more pewpew

I've not long come back from Hawaii. I know from the form I had to fill in on the plane. If I was a convicted Criminal as Ms Stewart now is. There is a big chance the US of A would not of let me in.

England may well have similar rules. Since she is rich, and on TV. Why should she be treated any diffrent. It's her consequence for being a convicted criminal. A person whom spent time in jail.

Pattison said A person whom spent time in jail.

And what the hell's wrong with that?!

Buckwheet said[quote][cite]Pattison said[/cite] A person whom spent time in jail.

And what the hell's wrong with that?![/quote]

One did not state anything was wrong with it. But....some country's (most) feel it disqualifies you from entering their country. So within that. It's relevant.

I don't feel the UK, in this case did wrong, as the US of A do the very same thing. Just because she is on TV, it should make no difference.

Non the less As for some one going to jail. Once they have done their time for the crime. It's over. But not if you want to travel, it may well come back to haunt you.

Just as if some-one got done for molesting children. They loose the right to work with children.

muchmorethanmuscle saidHey, Caslon. I like that you read so much. That looks like an interesting book. I'll have to go to amazon.com to check it out.

To the rest of the world outside of America. Just because there are laws in the U.S. doesn't mean that every American supports it. Just because you see problems that arise from American intervention throughout the world doesn't mean that all Americans back it up or support it. So keep in mind when you want to castrate Americans with some below the belt remark, keep in mind that you are lumping over 300 million people as thinking and behaving the same way. It's not the case.

I'm not happy that people outside the U.S. with HIV can't enter the states. I've heard of this before but I'm not sure how it works. Who divulges what to whom and to what agency? I don't know how that works entirely. In the U.S. Americans have rights concerning privacy in regards to their medical history. If I were to go and talk about someone's medical conditions I could be sued for divulging privileged information.

I know of a guy that did this to another man concerning his hiv status. That man took him to court and won.

Ah, you seem to think that we "out siders" who have taken a dislike to america to mean you the individual.

Alas, no, I don't for a moment think that its the people or, should I say, that its not most of the people, I have many american friends who, for what ever reason, I think there awesome people.

I think on the whole, if you disregard some of the shocking things that happened while I was in the states some time ago, everyone was delightful and very friendly, although, really, you guys do need to become more worldy, no, I do not know mel gibson, no, we don't actually eat shrimp from the barby, we do occasionally have prawns however and yes, we do have cell phones there called mobile phones. We also have a thriving economy and live in houses.

However, America, as a whole, is rather, um, unappealing, you talk about being a world police, the police here in Australia, are here to protect everyone, not there own interests.

America invades a country not because its best for the rest of the world, but for there own interests, at least from what I've read.
YES occasionally with americans actions there is a positive outcome for the rest of us (at least regarding oil) however, that is only a side effect and not the intention, the intention was for its own gain and not everyone's gain.

So yes, I have a poor view of america (and I am quickly getting a poor view of australia too) there are many problems in the world, america doesn't appear to be doing anything to fix them.. BUT, I do know, for an absolute fact that many of its people are working on it them self's which makes me happy

And Boy George is denied entry into the US. Hmmm, I wonder if we have so quid pro quo going on here. They have us keep an annoying celebrity here, they keep an annoying celebrity there?

lilTanker said[quote][cite]muchmorethanmuscle said[/cite]Hey, Caslon. I like that you read so much. That looks like an interesting book. I'll have to go to amazon.com to check it out.

To the rest of the world outside of America. Just because there are laws in the U.S. doesn't mean that every American supports it. Just because you see problems that arise from American intervention throughout the world doesn't mean that all Americans back it up or support it. So keep in mind when you want to castrate Americans with some below the belt remark, keep in mind that you are lumping over 300 million people as thinking and behaving the same way. It's not the case.

I'm not happy that people outside the U.S. with HIV can't enter the states. I've heard of this before but I'm not sure how it works. Who divulges what to whom and to what agency? I don't know how that works entirely. In the U.S. Americans have rights concerning privacy in regards to their medical history. If I were to go and talk about some one's medical conditions I could be sued for divulging privileged information.

Well said. I love Oz. But I'm happy I want be here in 50 years time, because of the direction we are taking. We are loosing our own identity, and why?

I know of a guy that did this to another man concerning his hiv status. That man took him to court and won.

Ah, you seem to think that we "outsiders" who have taken a dislike to America to mean you the individual.

Alas, no, I don't for a moment think that its the people or, should I say, that its not most of the people, I have many american friends who, for what ever reason, I think there awesome people.

I think on the whole, if you disregard some of the shocking things that happened while I was in the states some time ago, everyone was delightful and very friendly, although, really, you guys do need to become more worldly, no, I do not know mel gibson, no, we don't actually eat shrimp from the barby, we do occasionally have prawns however and yes, we do have cell phones there called mobile phones. We also have a thriving economy and live in houses.

However, America, as a whole, is rather, um, unappealing, you talk about being a world police, the police here in Australia, are here to protect everyone, not there own interests.

America invades a country not because its best for the rest of the world, but for there own interests, at least from what I've read.
YES occasionally with americans actions there is a positive outcome for the rest of us (at least regarding oil) however, that is only a side effect and not the intention, the intention was for its own gain and not every one's gain.

So yes, I have a poor view of america (and I am quickly getting a poor view of australia too) there are many problems in the world, america doesn't appear to be doing anything to fix them.. BUT, I do know, for an absolute fact that many of its people are working on it them self's which makes me happy[/quote]

muchmorethanmuscle saidI know it's a law that applies to everyone. I just didn't know that it was in affect until it was brought to my attention with the news story surrounding Ms. Stewart.

I just think it's over the top. I think it should be the type of crime. If she were accused of murder or causing bodily harm to others than she should be on a tight leash.

And yes it was the UK, sorry for typing out England instead. I did start with using UK but changed it.

Have you ever been to the UK?

Why is Martha Stewart even news?

I've never been to the U.K.

Was she wearing a Birka?

Why yes I believe so. Her own in fact.

muchmorethanmuscle saidI've never been to the U.K.

OK So why do you knock it so much?

Honestly, because I get tired of those few guys on here that are from the UK that are always bad mouthing Americans.

It may sound a bit ridiculous that I mention events associated with Britain that happened hundreds of years ago. But those actions still affect the world in which we live in today. There are many examples of this. Spain and Latin America, which actually was a lot more of a volatile experience by comparison. The Japanese...and yes also America. I was simply trying to make a point that every country has exploited another weaker nation at some point. Basically, NO COUNTRY IS INNOCENT.

I'm just tired of reading how people (some of them from RJ) from other countries are always bad mouthing Americans. It's just plain rude. If I were to go to a bar or restaurant in the U.S. and talk negatively making comments about the Puerto Ricans or the Mexicans or the Chinese I would have a lot of people, fellow Caucasian Americans mind you, that would think that I'm an obnoxious asshole. And I wouldn't blame them. And as I made mention before, it's as if a double standard exists. People can talk about the Americans in such a negative context and think nothing of it. If I were to say Oh the Mexicans do this or the Puerto Ricans don't do that and the British are notorious for blah blah blah I would be labeled as a racist. It's just a perplexing dynamic to me that when people say it about Americans that they find nothing wrong with their generalizations.

Aside from having English lineage I'm also part Welsh, Scottish and Spanish. I have more interest in going to Wales and Scotland first. They seem a lot more interesting to me. I've been to Spain and walked the Camino de Santiago a few years back and have been to Spain several times after. I had a really nice time. I've been to Paris once and I'd never go there again.

Another interesting dynamic is although so many people in the world like to talk badly of Americans - you have so many people from these same countries trying to sneak their hypocritical asses into America to live.

Pattison said A person whom spent time in jail.

Buckwheet said
And what the hell's wrong with that?!

Pattison said
One did not state anything was wrong with it. But....some country's (most) feel it disqualifies you from entering their country. So within that. It's relevant.

I was trying for a defensive tone to appear to have spent time in jail. It's all good.

Within a span of 5 minutes I convinced someone at work that I had two daughters in another state and had did hard time in prison. I fessed up of course, but it was funny.